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Topic: History of Computer Algebra
Replies: 42   Last Post: Nov 12, 2001 7:48 PM

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Dr. Barsuhn

Posts: 64
Registered: 12/8/04
Re: History of Computer Algebra, factoring, integratioin
Posted: Nov 11, 2001 4:14 PM
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Richard Fateman schrieb:

> Dr. Jürgen Barsuhn wrote:
>
> ............

> >>Whether any of the well known CAS implement the Risch algorithm
> >>"completely" should be asked. Perhaps there is an implementation
> >>by Bronstein (in Axiom?)
> >>

> >
> > There was a posting in this newsgroup a few weeks ago that there is so far no
> > "Risch-complete" CAS

>

Actually this posting was a year ago and it was written by Bronstein. I attach its
text below:

***************************
Subject: Re: Integration algorithm
Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 10:38:01 +0100
From: Manuel Bronstein <manuel.bronstein@sophia.inria.fr>
Organization: INRIA
CC: mywyb2@cam.ac.uk, bmanuel@sophia.inria.fr
Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.math.maple

MYWY Becker wrote:
>
> Does anyone know whether the integration algorithm in Maple is
> Risch-complete? That is, if Maple's answer is not an elementary
> function, can you be sure that there doesn't exist an elementary answer?
> In other words, has Maple implemented the *entire* Risch-like algorithm,
> in particular the *entire* algebraic case?


It is not Risch-complete, even in the purely transcendental
case (recursion problems in the logarithmic case). It is not
complete either in the purely algebraic case (see below),
and certainly not in the mixed algebraic-transcendental case.

Neither is Axiom (despite various rumors). The difference
is that Axiom issues an error message when an unimplemented
branch of the algorithm is hit, so an unevaluated integral
in Axiom is a proof that the integral is not elementary.

Neither is Mathematica, despite all the hype and ads
(source code is unavailable but "black box" experiments
show Mma's integrator to be in the, ahem, "low" category).

For the sceptics, here is an elementary integral of an
algebraic function, whose integral is a simple logarithm,
missed by the Risch integrators of both Maple and Mma:

Mathematica 4.0:
g = x / Sqrt[x^4 + 10 x^2 - 96 x - 71]
Integrate[g,x]
f = -Log[(x^6+15 x^4-80 x^3+27 x^2-528 x+781) Sqrt[x^4+10 x^2-96 x-71]
- x^8 - 20 x^6 + 128 x^5 - 54 x^4 + 1408 x^3 - 3124 x^2 - 10001]/8
Simplify[D[f,x] - g]

Maple 5.5 and Maple 6:
g := x / sqrt(x^4 + 10*x^2 - 96*x - 71);
int(g,x);
int(convert(g,RootOf),x);
f := -log((x^6+15*x^4-80*x^3+27*x^2-528*x+781) *
sqrt(x^4+10*x^2-96*x-71)
- x^8 - 20*x^6 + 128*x^5 - 54*x^4 + 1408*x^3 - 3124*x^2 - 10001)/8;
normal(diff(f,x)-g);

For fairness, here is an easy one that Axiom cannot decide:
integrate(sqrt atan x,x)

-- Manuel Bronstein
-- Manuel.Bronstein@sophia.inria.fr
-- http://www.inria.fr/cafe/Manuel.Bronstein/






Date Subject Author
10/19/01
Read History of Computer Algebra
Dr. Barsuhn
10/19/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Jesper Harder
10/19/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Richard Fateman
10/20/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra / correction
Richard Fateman
10/22/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Dr. Barsuhn
10/23/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Andreas Unterkircher
10/25/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Dr. Barsuhn
10/20/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Dr. Barsuhn
11/1/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Raphael
11/1/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Dr. Barsuhn
11/6/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
samuel powell
11/8/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Keith Geddes
11/9/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
David N. Williams
11/9/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Dr. Barsuhn
11/10/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
David N. Williams
11/10/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Dr. Barsuhn
11/12/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Heike
11/12/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Dr. Barsuhn
11/9/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Dr. Barsuhn
11/10/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra, factoring, integratioin
Richard Fateman
11/10/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra, factoring, integratioin
Dr. Barsuhn
11/10/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra, factoring, integratioin
Ronald Bruck
11/10/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra, factoring, integratioin
Richard Fateman
11/11/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra, factoring, integratioin
Dr. Barsuhn
11/10/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Michael Milgram
11/10/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
David N. Williams
11/10/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Michael Milgram
11/10/01
Read Schoonschip
Richard Fateman
11/11/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Michael Milgram
11/11/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Richard B. Kreckel
11/10/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Michael Milgram
11/11/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Jaap Spies
11/11/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra / Schoonschip, also a comment on Altran
Richard Fateman
11/12/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra / Schoonschip, also a comment on Altran
Richard B. Kreckel
11/12/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra / Schoonschip, also a comment on Altran
Richard Fateman
11/12/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra / Schoonschip, also a comment on Altran
Keith Geddes
11/11/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Jaap Spies
11/11/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Jaap Spies
11/11/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
David N. Williams
11/11/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Mok-Kong Shen
11/12/01
Read Re: History of Computer Algebra
Dr. Barsuhn

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