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Topic: Failing Linear Algebra:
Replies: 91   Last Post: Jan 10, 2007 12:56 PM

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David C. Ullrich

Posts: 21,553
Registered: 12/6/04
Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Posted: May 10, 2004 12:07 PM
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On Mon, 10 May 2004 15:56:10 +0000 (UTC),
jdolan@math-rs-n03.math.ucr.edu (James Dolan) wrote:

>in article <rsku90pc4s1omkhee2sd1vdpt17eicehut@4ax.com>,
>david c. ullrich <ullrich@math.okstate.edu> wrote:
>
>|On Sun, 9 May 2004 20:43:01 +0000 (UTC),
>|jdolan@math-cl-n01.math.ucr.edu (James Dolan) wrote:
>|
>|>in article <c6oo3g$nd0$1@news.math.niu.edu>,
>|>dave rusin <rusin@vesuvius.math.niu.edu> wrote:
>|>
>|>|>> The student should be able to give a rendition that is at least
>|>|>> equivalent to the one given in the book and that uses precise language.
>|>|>
>|>|> Let me try that one...independence means a group of vectors (in
>|>|> homogenous form???) such that if they all equal the zero vector, then
>|>|> the only possible way for that is the each coefficient of every vector
>|>|> has to equal 0 too.
>|>|
>|>|OK, now, jdolan and others who pooh-poohed the idea of memorizing
>|>|definitions: what say you to this student? Seems to me he has
>|>|made my point for me ...
>|>
>|>
>|>hi dave. i've been too busy to keep up with this thread lately, but i
>|>happened to glance at the new "linear algebra definitions" thread that
>|>the student in question started a couple of days ago, and it looks
>|>like he has unmade your point for you.
>|>
>|>anyway, i think it does students a great disservice to conflate the
>|>very important ability to engage in precise reasoning with the
>|>completely unimportant ability to memorize definitions.
>|
>|And you _really_ think that if he's saying things like "independence
>|means a group of vectors (in homogenous form???) such that if they
>|all equal the zero vector, then the only possible way for that is
>|the each coefficient of every vector has to equal 0 too" he's
>|going to be able to engage in precise reasoning about independence?
>
>presumably if i thought that then i would have said something remotely
>like it. i'll take the fact that you're spewing nonsense like this
>now as your concession that you've lost the argument.


Uh, you don't seem to be making much sense - from your last
two posts it appears that you agree that each of the following
statements is correct:

(i) the ability to engage in precise reasoning is very important.
(ii) the ability to memorize definitions is relatively unimportant.
(iii) someone whose notion of a certain definition is as above
will not be able to engage in precise reasoning.

Those three statements seem mutually inconsistent.

I imagine I'm missing something. Which part of what you've
said am I misinterpreting?

************************

David C. Ullrich



Date Subject Author
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Daniel Grubb
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Marc Olschok
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Daniel Grubb
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Marc Olschok
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Daniel Grubb
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Thomas Nordhaus
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Dave Rusin
4/25/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Jonathan Miller
4/25/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Felix Goldberg
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Daniel Grubb
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Tim Mellor
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
James Dolan
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Daniel Grubb
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
James Dolan
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Daniel Grubb
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
gersh@bialer.com
4/29/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Daniel Grubb
4/29/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Dave Rusin
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Russell Blackadar
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Russell Blackadar
4/29/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Russell Blackadar
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Russell Blackadar
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David C. Ullrich
4/29/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Dave Rusin
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Law Hiu Chung
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Dave Seaman
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Marc Olschok
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
George Cox
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Dave Rusin
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Lee Rudolph
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Russell Blackadar
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Marc Olschok
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Toni Lassila
4/29/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
M L
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Thomas Nordhaus
4/30/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David C. Ullrich
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Toni Lassila
4/30/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Russell Blackadar
4/30/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Russell Blackadar
5/1/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Russell Blackadar
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
George Cox
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Marc Olschok
4/30/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
4/30/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Russell Blackadar
5/1/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Russell Blackadar
4/27/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Thomas Nordhaus
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David C. Ullrich
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Dave Rusin
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David C. Ullrich
5/9/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
James Dolan
5/10/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David C. Ullrich
5/10/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
James Dolan
5/10/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David C. Ullrich
5/10/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Marc Olschok
5/10/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David C. Ullrich
4/27/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Thomas Nordhaus
4/27/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
magidin@math.berkeley.edu
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David C. Ullrich
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Marc Olschok
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David C. Ullrich
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Tim Mellor
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Daniel Grubb
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Daniel Grubb
4/27/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David C. Ullrich
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Dave Rusin
4/28/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Daniel Grubb
4/27/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Guest
1/10/07
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Marc Olschok
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Wayne Brown
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
Thomas Nordhaus
4/24/04
Read Re: Failing Linear Algebra:
David Ames

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