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Topic: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Replies: 31   Last Post: Mar 28, 2012 4:52 PM

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Louis Talman

Posts: 4,503
Registered: 12/27/05
Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Posted: Mar 28, 2012 12:57 AM
  Click to see the message monospaced in plain text Plain Text   Click to reply to this topic Reply

Well, I said there was no issue, didn't I? Now you've confirmed that
there isn't.

And no---I'm not worried about a 70% failure rate in calculus at the
high school level. Greeno has addressed some of the issues I didn't.
One he didn't touch on was high school students often load up on AP
Courses, including AP Calculus, in a misguided attempt to gain
admission to "elite" colleges and universities. This may be the main
force that has driven the expansion of the AP program in the last two
or three decades. When students enroll in mathematics for reasons
other than a sincere interest in mathematics, a high failure rate is
exactly what we should expect.

And, concerning money: Both the CB and ETS are non-profit; there are
no stock-holders they must keep happy, and the money they make has to
be plowed back into their programs. If there is an internal motive for
CB and ETS to expand their programs, it's no more than the standard
administrators' desire to push more paper, control more people, and
expand their empires.

On Tue, Mar 27, 2012 at 7:18 PM, Robert Hansen <bob@rsccore.com> wrote:

> Lou, if you read the AP report to the Nation, I would say that your statement below is exactly wrong. It appears that Florida is a leader in running the AP program exactly how the College Board thinks the AP program should be run...
>
> http://media.collegeboard.com/digitalServices/public/pdf/ap/rtn/AP-Report-to-the-Nation.pdf
>
> All kidding aside, have you ever seen a report more indicative of Haim's prime directive than this? Although, I believe as I have said before, while the prime directive might be the plot device this commercial enterprise boldly uses, this is no more about that prime directive than oncology is about curing cancer. This is about money. This is now an industrial strength commercial scam no different than bottled water and anti bacterial soap (unless of course you believe those are modern marvels).
>
> Lately, the question I ask myself most now is not about math at all. It is the following...
>
> Is an enduring public good simply not possible in this country? And will it ever be?
>
> PS: This indictment does not apply to the individual AP teachers, many of whom work very hard. It applies entirely to the crafters of that report, the College Board. It leaves no doubt anymore who the intended beneficiary is.
>
> Bob Hansen
>
>
> On Mar 27, 2012, at 6:28 PM, Louis Talman wrote:
>

>> Florida evidently has a preparation problem---whether it pertains to
>> teachers, to students, or to both I can't say. But it seems clear that
>> a large fraction of Florida's students who enroll in AP Calculus are
>> not prepared to do so, or that a large fraction of Florida's teachers
>> who teach AP Calculus are not prepared to do so, or that both
>> statements are true. That's a local problem---not a problem with the
>> AP program.

>



- --
- --Louis A. Talman
  Department of Mathematical and Computer Sciences
  Metropolitan State College of Denver

  <http://rowdy.mscd.edu/%7Etalmanl>


Date Subject Author
3/23/12
Read Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Ken Abbott
3/23/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Paul A. Tanner III
3/24/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Clyde Greeno @ MALEI
3/26/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
kirby urner
3/26/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
kirby urner
3/26/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen
3/26/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Haim
3/26/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Louis Talman
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Louis Talman
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen
3/28/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Louis Talman
3/28/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen
3/28/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Louis Talman
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Clyde Greeno @ MALEI
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen
3/28/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Louis Talman
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen
3/28/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Louis Talman
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Haim
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
kirby urner
3/28/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
kirby urner
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Domenico Rosa
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Dave L. Renfro
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Domenico Rosa
3/27/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Haim
3/28/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Haim
3/28/12
Read Re: Discussion: Do US Math Teachers Suck?
Robert Hansen

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