Drexel dragonThe Math ForumDonate to the Math Forum



Search All of the Math Forum:

Views expressed in these public forums are not endorsed by Drexel University or The Math Forum.


Math Forum » Discussions » sci.math.* » sci.math

Topic: Matheology § 246
Replies: 246   Last Post: Apr 26, 2013 2:37 AM

Advanced Search

Back to Topic List Back to Topic List Jump to Tree View Jump to Tree View   Messages: [ Previous | Next ]
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de

Posts: 15,737
Registered: 1/29/05
Re: Matheology § 246
Posted: Apr 13, 2013 2:52 PM
  Click to see the message monospaced in plain text Plain Text   Click to reply to this topic Reply

On 13 Apr., 19:59, dullr...@sprynet.com wrote:
> On Sat, 13 Apr 2013 09:58:39 -0700 (PDT), WM
>
> <mueck...@rz.fh-augsburg.de> wrote:

> >On 13 Apr., 16:47, dullr...@sprynet.com wrote:
>
> >> Curiously you deleted my statement of exactly what error of
> >> yours I was referring to. Why was that?

>
> >What do you allude to? Why don't you repeat it, if it was important?
>
> You asserted that "He concludes that this remains true for the limits
> of
> the list numbers r and d by using the argument: different sequences
> have different limits."
>
> And that is simply not true.


Remember, what you said: Only cases like 0.999... = 1.000... can lead
to same limits. This holds if you have digits a_n multiplied by powers
of 10^-n. But Cantor simply used bits that he called w and m. Without
a topology, there are no limits at all! There are only strings of
bits. So also the anti-diagonal d is not a limit - it is simply a
string of bits without end. And of that kind you can find behind every
finite string of bits (d_1, ..., d_n) the same string repeated
infinitely often. For every n. Further nothing happens in the list.
>
> > I
> >delete all phrases which I do not consider important for the further
> >discussion. Otherwise the post would be too long.
> >But if you think a bit about the following questions, you will
> >certainly recognize that your attempts are in vain, to find an error
> >in my theory:

>
> >A) {1} U {1, 2} U {1, 2, 3} U ...
> >B) {1}, {1, 2}, {1, 2, 3}, ...
> >C) {1}, {1} U {1, 2}, {1} U {1, 2} U {1, 2, 3}, {1} U {1, 2} U {1, 2,
> >3} U ..., ...
> >Is A contained in C?

>
> No, of course not.


Then let me know the first natural number that is in A but not in C.
You know that every non-empty set of natural numbers has a first
element. That is even true in common mathematics without any set
theory.
>
> >Is anything in C that is not in B?
>
> >In case you tend to answer the first question with a resounding no
> >(like Feferman answered the question: "Is Cantor necessary"), please
> >be prepared to find something of A that is not contained in C - as
> >custom has it in mathematics.

>
> A = {1,2,3,...}, and that set is not in B.


I appreciate your clear speech. But I do not believe you. So I invite
you to determine a natural number, possibly the first one, that is in
A but not in B.
Please be aware, that I require mathematics, not matheology. In the
latter case the faithful believe that A contains only all finite
natural numbers and that B also contains all finite natural numbers,
but that the U has some magig power like the horseshoe that Bohr hat
nailed above the door of his summer house. And when Heisenberg asked
him, whether he, Bohr, was superstitious believing in good luck spent
by the horseshoe, Bohr answered, no, he did not believe, but the
horseshoe is said to be of help inspite of that.

Well, please do not use such arguments. Speak frankly, what is missing
in B that is present in A? Sets are differing by elements. If all
elements of A are in B and vice versa, then by Zermelo's first axiom,
A = B.

Regards, WM


Date Subject Author
4/12/13
Read Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
JT
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Scott Berg
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Scott Berg
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
David C. Ullrich
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Bergholt Stuttley Johnson
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/12/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
David C. Ullrich
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
David C. Ullrich
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
David C. Ullrich
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/15/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/15/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/15/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/16/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/16/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Bergholt Stuttley Johnson
4/16/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/15/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/15/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Bergholt Stuttley Johnson
4/15/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/16/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/16/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/16/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/16/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/16/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/16/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/16/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Tanu R.
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
gus gassmann
4/18/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/18/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/21/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
gus gassmann
4/21/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/21/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Bergholt Stuttley Johnson
4/23/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/24/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/24/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/24/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/25/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/25/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/25/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/25/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/25/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/25/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/25/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/25/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/26/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Bergholt Stuttley Johnson
4/25/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
gus gassmann
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
gus gassmann
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/23/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/23/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/23/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/23/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/23/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/24/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/24/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/23/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/24/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/24/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/24/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/25/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/23/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/22/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/18/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/19/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/19/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/19/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/19/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/19/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/19/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/19/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/19/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/18/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/18/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/18/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/18/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Bergholt Stuttley Johnson
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Ralf Bader
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/18/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/17/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/15/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
fom
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology ? 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology ? 246
Tanu R.
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology ? 246
Tanu R.
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology ? 246
Tanu R.
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology ? 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology § 246
Tanu R.
4/14/13
Read Re: Matheology � 246
Virgil
4/13/13
Read Re: Matheology ? 246
Virgil

Point your RSS reader here for a feed of the latest messages in this topic.

[Privacy Policy] [Terms of Use]

© Drexel University 1994-2014. All Rights Reserved.
The Math Forum is a research and educational enterprise of the Drexel University School of Education.