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Topic: closed universe, flat space?
Replies: 48   Last Post: May 5, 2013 2:45 PM

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xxein

Posts: 3
Registered: 4/18/13
Re: closed universe, flat space?
Posted: Apr 23, 2013 7:59 PM
  Click to see the message monospaced in plain text Plain Text   Click to reply to this topic Reply

On Apr 23, 3:23 pm, RichD <r_delaney2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Supposedly, our universe is closed and finite, although the
> geometry and topology isn't precisely known.  This means
> a straight line (geodesic)  traveler must return to his starting
> poiint, yes/no?  Hence, curved space.
>
> At the same time, astronomers claim, that space is flat, to
> the precision of their measurements.  Usually, this is
> accompanied by the comment that the universe is balanced
> between infinite expansion, or eventual collapse, we can't
> tell which.
>
> So, space is closed, but also flat...  back in my day, they
> had something called a logical contradiction, which was
> considered a bad thing, but I guess times change...
> viva progress -
>
> --
> Rich


xxein: It's just a lot of proclamation of limited imagination. Not
to mention the case where an outfielder does all the proscribed math
in his head to catch a fly ball.

It is evident that the universe is expanding and that a local gravity
has the opposite effect. Who will win?

But back to your starting point. Terms like geometry and topology are
man-made. They only exist because that's the mental process by which
we think. So we call that a science. In this case, physics. They
are mental compilation descriptors of what we seem able to observe.
Way back in the day, there was Earth, wind, water and fire. Then the
Sun during the day and stars at night. An easily observed object in
the night sky was the moon. We not only wondered, we invented a
reason for these observations.

And that's what we still do today. It may be called a version of a
formal physics but there are many versions of it. So what is the
actual physic? What is really happening and why?

We only guess with more definitive man-made reasons.

We get to the point of producing electricity for many tasks. Do we
ever really understand it as the physic or do we just use it because
we have developed a way to do that and call it physics?

Getting back to space, it is assumed to be empty/a vacuum. If so,
what is a universe? We claim energy/dark energy, matter/dark matter.
Things that seem to exist in this vacuum. We exist and can measure
stuff. This means that there is some sort of fluidity wrt time that
we can measure at least as a change.

So now we have science claiming that space is empty vacuum within our
universe? How then does space get to be curved without a medium to do
it within?

Is this medium static? I hardly think so. Try looking at
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/space/how-big-universe.html and it might
alter your view.


Date Subject Author
4/23/13
Read closed universe, flat space?
Rich Delaney
4/23/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Poutnik
4/24/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
4/29/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Rich Delaney
4/23/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
kenseto
4/24/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
JT
4/24/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
herbert glazier
4/24/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Double-A
4/23/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Nicolas Bonneel
4/29/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Rich Delaney
4/29/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Mike Terry
4/23/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
xxein
4/23/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Brian Q. Hutchings
4/23/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Butch Malahide
4/23/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Newberry
4/24/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Koobee Wublee
4/24/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/24/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Koobee Wublee
4/24/13
Read space is locally curved, as has been measured
Brian Q. Hutchings
4/25/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/25/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
herbert glazier
4/25/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/25/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
bradguth@gmail.com
4/27/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Brian Q. Hutchings
5/4/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
bradguth@gmail.com
5/5/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Brian Q. Hutchings
4/25/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Koobee Wublee
4/25/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/25/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Koobee Wublee
4/25/13
Read closed universe, flat space, ignore Minkowski's worse nD geometry;
thank you
Brian Q. Hutchings
4/26/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space, ignore Minkowski's worse nD
geometry; thank you
Brian Q. Hutchings
4/27/13
Read curved space and/or curved time (time is the "real, scalar" part of
vector mechanics -- like a God-am clock
Brian Q. Hutchings
4/27/13
Read Re: curved space and/or curved time (time is the "real, scalar" part
of vector mechanics -- like a God-am clock
Brian Q. Hutchings
4/27/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Tom Roberts
4/27/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Koobee Wublee
4/27/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Brian Q. Hutchings
4/29/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Rich Delaney
4/29/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
4/29/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Koobee Wublee
4/30/13
Read Kepler uncovered the curvature via his three orbital constraints
(reciprocal of diameter)
Brian Q. Hutchings
4/30/13
Read Minkowski was an otherwise-great geometer!
Brian Q. Hutchings
5/1/13
Read Minkowski, Minkowski, Minkowski -- say it, againsville
Brian Q. Hutchings
5/1/13
Read Kepler's cosmological curvature thingies
Brian Q. Hutchings
5/3/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Rich Delaney
5/4/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
5/4/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
5/4/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
dan.ms.chaos@gmail.com
5/5/13
Read Re: closed universe, flat space?
Koobee Wublee
5/5/13
Read eight to the bar -- Daddy!
Brian Q. Hutchings

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