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Topic: Why do so many of us hate math?
Replies: 174   Last Post: Jul 24, 2014 2:21 AM

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GS Chandy

Posts: 7,036
From: Hyderabad, Mumbai/Bangalore, India
Registered: 9/29/05
Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Posted: Jul 2, 2014 3:05 AM
  Click to see the message monospaced in plain text Plain Text   Click to reply to this topic Reply

I have over time quite carefully *read through* ALL the messages in ALL the strands of this thread (and have just now made a 'quick review' of some of them). [I note, however, that I've not formally *studied* them, i.e. I've not done any detailed 'systems modeling' of the messages in the various strands though I have made a few informal models to aid my personal understanding, and to help me write this posting]:

- -- Starting with its initiation by Joe N. (dt. Jun 14, 2014 9:23 PM, http://mathforum.org/kb/thread.jspa?forumID=206&threadID=2635880&messageID=9486835#9486835),

down to:
- -- the current strand being this one headed by the post from Anna Roys (dt. Jun 27, 2014 11:15 PM, http://mathforum.org/kb/message.jspa?messageID=9504989), the latest postings being a series of exchanges between Joe N. and Robert Hansen on issues related to music, rhythm, drums, etc.

I must confess that I for one am musically somewhat 'illiterate', alas: I really do enjoy listening to many forms of music (except, probably, heavy metal and most other such noise manifestations).

I repeat I'm musically almost totally illiterate and I cannot discuss harmony, rhythm, etc, in the least knowledgeably (and most of the music-related discussion at this thread has gone over my head, I'm afraid).

At one stage, while I was involved in graduate studies in math, I did make a serious effort - even audited a course -to understand the 'linkages' between the music of Bach and math - but I'm afraid I didn't complete that course as I found I did need some technical and practical understanding of music in general and Bach's music in particular. After that, I tried to read quite a bit about the relationship between math and music, but did not get far because of my lack of needed technical background of music /skill with musical instruments.

I DO know that there are very close 'parallels' (if that's the correct word) between our (human) understanding/ appreciation of music and our understanding of math. Probably appreciation of math takes rather more more direct intellectual effort than does appreciation of many forms of music. Thus, my comments below do not apply to any of the discussions involving music, harmony, rhythm etc as discussed by Joe N. and Robert Hansen. As an aside, I note that South Indian music, especially what's known as 'Carnatic music' encompasses some very complex and involved 'theory of music' that is based on some pretty terrific math - but I understand little or nothing of that, except as a 'casual listener' on occasion.

Given all of the above as my starting position, I believe that rather few of the posts at the various strands of this thread - with the exception - to an extent - of the posts by Anna Roys and Ray - have served actually to clarify the question in the title of the thread:

"Why do so many of us hate math?"

(I acknowledge that Robert Hansen has pointed out that it's not 'math' itself that people hate, but, rather, 'math lessons'. While it's true enough, this is, in my opinion, an entirely specious distinction - and it makes no difference whatso3ever to the case being argued by me).

NONE of the posts has actually enabled us (or anyone else) to *do* something (/anything?), in practice on the ground, or to work towards removing (or at least minimising) the 'fear and loathing' the great majority of students feel for math by the time they pass out from school. Except that I've pointed to the 'One Page Management System' (OPMS) as a tool that could help, in practice on the ground, to help us work on a Mission such as:

"To minimise the 'fear and loathing' that the great majority of students feel towards math by the time they graduate from school".

It can be very convincingly demonstrated, with no great difficulty at all (for those who have the needed intellectual stamina), that the above 'Mission' could be very successfully and *measurably* accomplished, even nationwide (whether in the USA; in India; or in any other nation that's afflicted by the above-noted 'fear and loathing' of math). (The above 'Mission' can be measurably accomplished within just a couple of years of even a fairly small group of the 'right stakeholders' taking it up)

Doubtless Robert Hansen will now call for me to be banned from Math-teach for what he describes as spamming. This is ironical, as he has understood just about zero of what I am or have been discussing.

All of the above comments are made in the awareness that I lack an adequate solid understanding of ('American') English poetry to satisfy Robert Hansen that I've fully understood the 'subtleties' of his posts.

GSC


Message was edited by: GS Chandy


Date Subject Author
6/27/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Anna Roys
6/27/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
6/28/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
6/29/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
6/29/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
6/29/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
6/29/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
6/29/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
6/30/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
6/29/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
6/29/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Ray
7/4/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/4/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
kirby urner
7/4/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/4/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
kirby urner
6/30/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
israeliteknight
6/30/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
israeliteknight
6/30/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Wayne Bishop
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
6/30/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
6/30/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
6/30/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/1/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Louis Talman
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Louis Talman
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Wayne Bishop
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Wayne Bishop
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
kirby urner
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Wayne Bishop
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Louis Talman
7/2/14
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Gary Tupper
7/2/14
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Louis Talman
7/2/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/2/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/4/14
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Wayne Bishop
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
kirby urner
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/3/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Anna Roys
7/3/14
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Anna Roys
7/3/14
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Robert Hansen
7/4/14
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Robert Hansen
7/4/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/4/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/4/14
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kirby urner
7/6/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Wayne Bishop
7/7/14
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Wayne Bishop
7/4/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/4/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/4/14
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Robert Hansen
7/4/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/4/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/4/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/4/14
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Robert Hansen
7/5/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/5/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/5/14
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GS Chandy
7/5/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/5/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/5/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/5/14
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GS Chandy
7/5/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/6/14
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Robert Hansen
7/6/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/5/14
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GS Chandy
7/6/14
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Robert Hansen
7/6/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/6/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/6/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/6/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/6/14
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Louis Talman
7/6/14
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Robert Hansen
7/7/14
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Wayne Bishop
7/7/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/7/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/7/14
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Robert Hansen
7/7/14
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GS Chandy
7/7/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/7/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/7/14
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Wayne Bishop
7/8/14
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Robert Hansen
7/8/14
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Wayne Bishop
7/7/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/7/14
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Robert Hansen
7/8/14
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GS Chandy
7/7/14
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GS Chandy
7/8/14
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GS Chandy
7/9/14
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Robert Hansen
7/7/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/8/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Wayne Bishop
7/8/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Louis Talman
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/8/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/8/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/8/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Wayne Bishop
7/8/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/8/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Wayne Bishop
7/8/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
israeliteknight
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Joe Niederberger
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
israeliteknight
7/9/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/9/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/10/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
Robert Hansen
7/9/14
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Joe Niederberger
7/10/14
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israeliteknight
7/10/14
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GS Chandy
7/10/14
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Richard Strausz
7/10/14
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israeliteknight
7/10/14
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GS Chandy
7/10/14
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GS Chandy
7/10/14
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Richard Strausz
7/10/14
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israeliteknight
7/14/14
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GS Chandy
7/15/14
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israeliteknight
7/22/14
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GS Chandy
7/22/14
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GS Chandy
7/23/14
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israeliteknight
7/24/14
Read Re: Why do so many of us hate math?
GS Chandy

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