Date: Dec 2, 2010 8:05 PM
Author: Jonathan Groves
Subject: Re: Creating a List of Online Math Tutoring Sites

Alain and others,

I had told Wayne that I wholeheartedly agree with his statement
because I see any grade being based on meaningless learning goals
to be a meaningless grade. Grades can be meaningless for two

1. The learning goals the grades attempt to measure are meaningless
learning goals, regardless of how such grades are derived. When
good grades can be earned merely for doing work, then grades become
even more meaningless than before and perpetuate bad attitudes
in students: What else explains why many students complain that their
grades are low and suggest directly or indirectly that these low
grades are unfair because they did the work?

2. The learning goals for the course actually do have real meaning
and lasting benefits for students, but the grades are based merely
on effort or on other trivial standards. Of course, one can argue
if we can really have these kinds of meaningful learning goals if
we are not willing to assess students' progress in meeting these
goals. I too question that, but I did throw this option out here
because it is possible to list such meaningful goals in course
syllabi and teach in ways that line up with these goals.

Jonathan Groves

On 11/29/2010 at 10:21 pm, Alain Schremmer wrote:

> On Nov 29, 2010, at 10:07 AM, wmackey wrote:

> > As done now grades are essentially meaningless as
> assessments of
> > student learning.
> Not true at all: The grades are meaningless but then
> so is what they
> "learn"
> Best regards
> --schremmer
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