Date: Oct 11, 2012 6:00 PM
Author: Paul A. Tanner III
Subject: Re: US teachers are overworked and underpaid

On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 4:31 PM, Robert Hansen <bob@rsccore.com> wrote:
>
> On Oct 11, 2012, at 4:10 PM, Paul Tanner <upprho@gmail.com> wrote:
>

>> If I teach 6 hours per day and have 20 students in each one hour
> class, then I have 120 total students to deal with. If I teach 3 hours
> per day and have 20 students in each one hour class, then I have 60
> total students to deal with. The teacher-pupil ratio is the same, but

>> one teacher has double the teaching load of the other.
>
>
> So do the kids go to school only 3 hours a day? I guess we are not talking
> elementary school, we are talking high school? So in elementary school the
> teachers teach the same as us but in high school they only teach 3 hours? So
> do teachers share the classrooms? Or do half the classrooms sit empty half
> the day and the other half the other half of the day? Is this the vocational
> schools as well, or just the high schools? I guess it is possible since the
> high schools have screening in place. Once you remove the sports and the
> remedial classes, what's left? Do you have a link to some actual high school
> schedules that exhibit this? It seems like college hours.
>


?

Please read what I actually wrote in this thread before you reply further, including most especially ALL of what I cited and linked to. It gives you the information for high school, middle school, and elementary school, and for overall averages. I already said that this is not about the number of hours that a student spends per year or per week while school is in session in front of a teacher, but it is about the number of hours that a teacher per year or per week while school is in session spends in front of a class.

Again: Please do the math based on what I cited.

To reply to this above of yours specifically, for each week school is in session, using rounded off numbers that are close to the actual numbers so as to show what is going on most clearly:

For these three top-performing countries in question Korea, Finland, and Japan, and for US community college teachers, we have something like this: Two teachers teaching a total of 120 students means 60 students per teacher - 2 teachers each teaching an average of 3 hours per day, 15 hours per week. The students each spend 6 hours per day in front of a teacher. The student/teacher ratio PER CLASS is 20/1.

Compare that to what we see in the US at k12, where we have something like this: One teacher teaching a total of 120 students means 120 students per teacher - 1 teacher teaching an average of 6 hours per day, 30 hours per week. The students each spend 6 hours per day in front of a teacher. The student/teacher ratio PER CLASS is 20/1.

Why so many people keep confusing the student/teacher ratio *per class* and the student/teacher ratio *in terms of total number of students in all classes put together that a single teacher has to deal with* is beyond me.

I reiterate everything I said in my last post in this thread:

http://mathforum.org/kb/message.jspa?messageID=7904464