I had claimed: > <snip> > Either (A): you are not listening (quite possible: in > fact, US citizens DO NOT listen very effectively, in > general [IMHO]); or > <snip> The above might give the impression that it is only US citizens that do not listen effectively. I have found that it is, in fact, citizens of all nations around the world that do not know how to listen effectively. I have some fairly close experience with US citizens (though this is quite old**); plenty of experience with Indian citizens in a very wide variety of fields of endeavour and enterprise - and I can definitively confirm that the abilities to *listen* of middle-class Indian citizens is not really much better (if at all) than that of US citizens. Abilities of poorer Indian citizens is significantly better. (This last is my belief and anecdotal experience, though I do not have empirical evidence for the belief).
(**I do, however, 'keep up' with much that is going on in the USA via the news, discussion groups such as Math-teach, etc, etc. Also, I have very close relatives who live in/are citizens of the USA).
In this context, something Winston Churchill said long ago may be of interest:
"First, we shape our buildings; then our buildings shape us".
Just substitute the word and idea of "systems" for "buildings", and you'll have a piece of wisdom that should hold true for all time.
I claim that it's the 'systems' in which we're all embedded that prevent us from 'listening effectively'. There is, in fact, plenty of potential wisdom available all around us (in the good ideas we all have) that could help resolve a great many issues that confront us - we rarely, if ever, use our good ideas; instead, we generally prefer to hold on passionately to the very bad ideas floating around (check out the 'slogans' quoted just below for some examples of very bad ideas).
We all - US citizens as well as Indian citizens as well as citizens worldwide - do need to start understanding systems (and how to cope with them). This is a most urgent need indeed, if we (humanity at large) are to escape the abyss lying just ahead.
Attachments to my post heading the thread "Democracy - how to achieve it?" (see http://mathforum.org/kb/thread.jspa?threadID=2419536) describe a tool that could help us start understanding the systems we are confronted with, including our educational systems. To judge by the 'slogans' we've had floating around right here at Math-teach, the understanding of systems in the USA is remarkably defective.
Slogans floating around:
I: "PUT THE EDUCATIONAL MAFIA IN JAIL!" (Haim, who is alas no longer with us these days);
II: "BLOW UP THE SCHOOLS OF EDUCATION!" (Wayne Bishop, apparently inspired by a slogan originating from Reid Lyon [Reading Research Expert], has taken this up as his life work).
I understand that Greg Goodknight prefers a version articulated by a long-dead President of Harvard University in regard to Harvard's Graduate School of Education: "The school of education should have been drowned at birth as kittens are" (words to that effect). Same difference.
III: "Children must be PUSHED or GOADED to learn math!" (and presumably everything else) [Robert Hansen].
In some ways, I and II above may be regarded to be the 'outcomes', so to speak, of III.
GSC ("Still Shoveling! Not PUSHING!! Not GOADING!!!")