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Topic: number problem
Replies: 30   Last Post: Jul 3, 2013 12:08 AM

 Messages: [ Previous | Next ]
 mathguy Posts: 12 Registered: 6/23/13
Re: number problem
Posted: Jun 30, 2013 12:52 PM

On Friday, June 28, 2013 2:53:21 PM UTC-7, quasi wrote:
> japonishi wrote:
>
>
>

> >you math practitioners clearly have an abstract definition about
>
> >what is a set.. for us ordinary people, a box of identical paper
>
> >clips is a set of identical clips, period,
>
>
>
> Identical as far as appearance (at least approximately) and
>
> functionality (they are interchangeable as far as their intended
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> purpose) but they are _not_ physically identical. Do they have
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> the same atoms? Certainly not. Thus, the clips are physically
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> distinct, even you regard them (from your point of view as clip
>
> user) as indistinguishable.
>
>
>

> >so what I(we) call a set of numbers is just a collection of
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> >numbers, which may be distinct or repeated.
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>
>
> In mathematics, by agreement, sets do not allow for elements
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> to be counted more than once. If you need to consider repeated
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> elements, a sequence is a more appropriate structure.
>
>
>

> >i'm no fan of your abstract sets,
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>
>
> And yet you initially posted using the handle "mathguy".
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>
>

> >but thanks for clarifying the issue.
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>
>
> You're welcome.
>
>
>
> Note that when the Olympiad problem used the terminology
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> "a set of n elements", it was intended in the pure math sense.
>
> Thus the problem can't be trivially solved in the way you
>
> suggested, when you gave the example set {0,2,2,2,2,4},
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> which you initially claimed to be a set of 6 elements.
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>
>
> quasi

first of all, i'm no mathematician, just someone with recreational math interest, nothing wrong with "mathguy" as a handle, and i don't comment about your "quasi" handle, so be respectful of others. So for me(us), {0,2,2,2} is still a set of 4 elements, whether you like it or not. only when talking to hardcore maths should i refer to "multisets" or "sequences" or "lists" etc.
what do i care if paper clips are physically distinct, as in atomically distinct, all i care is they're functionally identical. 2 and 2 = 4, not 2.

Date Subject Author
6/23/13 mathguy
6/23/13 Timothy Murphy
6/23/13 mathguy
6/24/13 Timothy Murphy
6/24/13 Virgil
6/23/13 quasi
6/23/13 mathguy
6/23/13 quasi
6/24/13 mathguy
6/24/13 mathguy
6/24/13 quasi
6/24/13 mathguy
6/24/13 Don Redmond
6/25/13 mathguy
6/25/13 quasi
6/26/13 mathguy
6/27/13 quasi
6/28/13 mathguy
6/28/13 Tucsondrew@me.com
6/28/13 Peter Percival
6/28/13 quasi
6/30/13 mathguy
6/30/13 Peter Percival
6/30/13 quasi
6/30/13 Bart Goddard
6/30/13 Virgil
7/2/13 mathguy
7/2/13 Bart Goddard
7/2/13 quasi
7/2/13 quasi
7/3/13 Bart Goddard