The Math Forum



Search All of the Math Forum:

Views expressed in these public forums are not endorsed by NCTM or The Math Forum.


Math Forum » Discussions » sci.math.* » sci.math

Topic: Matheology § 074
Replies: 114   Last Post: Jul 22, 2012 4:15 PM

Advanced Search

Back to Topic List Back to Topic List Jump to Tree View Jump to Tree View   Messages: [ Previous | Next ]
Virgil

Posts: 8,833
Registered: 1/6/11
Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Posted: Jul 16, 2012 5:10 PM
  Click to see the message monospaced in plain text Plain Text   Click to reply to this topic Reply

In article
<64ea874d-6808-436f-88c3-8a952d90b27e@x21g2000vbc.googlegroups.com>,
WM <mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de> wrote:

> On 16 Jul., 22:19, Virgil <vir...@ligriv.com> wrote:
> > In article
> > <4b2ba1bb-c5d9-4bfc-ba78-2f9c667f1...@k21g2000vbj.googlegroups.com>,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  WM <mueck...@rz.fh-augsburg.de> wrote:

> > > On 16 Jul., 21:05, Virgil <vir...@ligriv.com> wrote:
> > > > In article
> >
> > > > > There is not the slightest difference!
> > > > > If one and the same supertask

> >
> > > > > 01
> > > > > 0.1
> > > > > 010.1
> > > > > 01.01
> > > > > 0101.01
> > > > > 010.101
> > > > > ...

> >
> > > > > is described in set theory, then the limit is < 1.
> >
> > > > Since the members of that sequence are not sets, no set limit is defined
> > > > by that sequence.

> >
> > > > > If it is described
> > > > > in mathematics, then the limit is oo.

> >
> > > > Since the members of that sequence are not standard numerals, they do
> > > > not represent numbers, so there is no basis on which to claim any limit
> > > > exists at all.

> >
> > > The members of that sequence are sets of numbers. Above encoding
> > > represents the numbers
> > > 21
> > > 2.1
> > > 432.1
> > > 43.21
> > > 6543.21
> > > 654.321
> > > ...

> >
> > > I use the interpretation as sequence of reals only in order to prove
> > > that the mathematrical limit contains infinitely many numbers, because
> > > a sequence of reals cannot go to infinity unless also the sets of
> > > digits go to infinity.

> >
> > Except that, as the limit of a sequence of sets, S_n, the only valid
> > limit would be the common value of lim_sup S_n and lim_inf S_n, if there
> > is one.
> >
> > And {} is provably that common value.

>
> In mathematics, the components (digits) of a diverging sequence of
> real numbers diverge also.


But in mathematics (which despite WM's delusions DOES contain numerous
set theories) the vase proble resolves into finding the limit of a
sequence of SETS, not a sequence of real numbers.
> >
> > When one looks for a limit value to a sequence of sets, one must use an
> > appropriate method for sequences of sets, which WM does not do.

>
> In mathematics we have
> a_n --> oo <==> set of digits of a_n does not vanish.


But a_n is NOT the set of numbered balls in the vase at any time, so is
irrelevant to the vase problem.
> >
> > The question being about the set of balls in the vase at t = 0, only set
> > methods are relevant.

>
> In mathematics, they are obviously irrelevant.


In WMathelogy sets may be irrelevant, but in STANDARD mathematics they
are quite relevant.
> >
> > So any attempt to solve the problem which gives a result different from
> > the one set methods gives is irrelevant, and an example of incompetent
> > analysis of the issues.

>
> Do you believe that the indexed digits of the sequence
> 1
> 10
> 100
> 1000
> ...
> converge to the empty set?


Unless all, or at least all but finitely many of them, are sets, the
sequence of them cannot converge to a set at all, at least not by any
mathematical procedure valid outside WMatheology.
>
> Regrads, WM

--




Date Subject Author
7/13/12
Read Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/13/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
MoeBlee
7/13/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
dilettante
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
dilettante
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
dilettante
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
dilettante
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
dilettante
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
dilettante
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
Frederick Williams
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
dilettante
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
dilettante
7/16/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/16/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/16/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/16/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/17/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/17/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/16/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/17/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
William Hughes
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
MoeBlee
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/16/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/17/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/17/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/17/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/17/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/18/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
YBM
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
FredJeffries@gmail.com
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
MoeBlee
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/19/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
MoeBlee
7/20/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/20/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/20/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/20/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/20/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/20/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/21/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/21/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/22/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/22/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/20/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
Marshall
7/20/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/20/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
YBM
7/20/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology � 074
Virgil
7/21/12
Read Re: WM's WMatheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/15/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
mueckenh@rz.fh-augsburg.de
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
dilettante
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology § 074
LudovicoVan
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil
7/14/12
Read Re: Matheology � 074
Virgil

Point your RSS reader here for a feed of the latest messages in this topic.

[Privacy Policy] [Terms of Use]

© The Math Forum at NCTM 1994-2017. All Rights Reserved.