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Topic: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Replies: 44   Last Post: May 12, 2011 8:18 AM

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John Anderson

Posts: 5
Registered: 5/5/11
Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Posted: May 5, 2011 12:34 PM
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The article that I spoke of relates to more than a single study.  I think the study you a referencing is one that received a great deal of attention last week.

Another straw-man that is often set up is the one that places all non-project-based math practice into the category of mindless, manipulation of symbols.  Other types of practice involve meta-cognition, categorization, and synthesis.  This strengthens students' ability to "figure things out."


As time allows, I will review that research you mentioned.

John Anderson
Lowell, IN



________________________________
From: John Clement <clement@hal-pc.org>
To: math-learn@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, May 5, 2011 11:04 AM
Subject: Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2


 
As I recall the article on "minimal guidance instruction" set up a straw man
and proceeded to burn it. What they called minimal guided instruction does
not in my experience exist. Perhaps a few misguided individuals do it, but
none of the PER techniques do this. They also did not consoder any of the
PER research. This article has been, in my opinion, debunked. Look at the
work of Shayer & Adey or the Hellers at U. Minn. Then there is the Benezit
experiment.

While complex open ended activities may inhibit some transfer to long-term
memory, short practice tends to make students think that it is just a matter
of memorizing without understanding. The subject of long-term memory is
much more complex than just transfer of information. It is a dynamic system
where recall changes existing ideas through the process or reconsolidation.
When ideas are merely practiced, without cognition, the pre-existing
paradigms are still there and come out to bite you.

For years people in physics have gotten students to memorize Newton's laws
and gave them simple practice problems. But when asked about a real life
situation which involved applying them, their "natural" paradigms
overwhelmed their memorize info, and they got them wrong. I know that
students have practiced invert and multiply, but still in college they will
tell me that 1/s divided by s is 1. Then I ask what is 1/2 divided by 2 and
they still say 1. So then I ask them to visualize 1/2 of something and
divide it by 2 and they get the correct 1/4.

As to building rigor incrementally, that is a "false" idea. Rigor is often
equated with the ability to do a variety of specific tasks, but in reality
what the student needs to gain is enough ability to use cognition to figure
out things, or be able to go to a source to find what they need to solve a
problem. Then if they are to become mathemeticians they will gain high
proficiency by practicing their trade.

John M. Clement
Houston, TX

>
> Complex problems certainly play an important role in
> mathematical understanding.  When those problems develop
> rigor incrementally, much is to be gained.  However, I
> believe a balance should be struck.  Educational
> psychologists point to the limited ability of complex,
> open-ended activities to move understanding into the
> long-term memory of students.  One such article, Why Minimal
> Guidance During Instruction Does Not Work: An Analysis of the
> Failure of Constructivist, Discovery, Problem-Based,
> Experiential, and Inquiry-Based Teachingby Kirschner,
> Sweller, and Clark does a good job of summarizing and
> clarifying this understanding.
>





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



Date Subject Author
5/5/11
Read [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Dennis
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Anderson
5/5/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Clement
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/5/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Clement
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Anderson
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/5/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Clement
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/5/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Clement
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/5/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Clement
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Anderson
5/5/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Clement
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Anderson
5/7/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Lewis
5/7/11
Read [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Scott Anderson
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Lewis
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Dennis
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Ralph A. Raimi
5/7/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Clement
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Scott Anderson
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/7/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Clement
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Dennis
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/8/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Lewis
5/8/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Dennis
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/8/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/12/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Dennis
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Dennis
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/5/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Clement
5/5/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Hansen
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Lewis
5/7/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
John Clement
5/7/11
Read RE: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Lewis
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Lewis
5/7/11
Read Re: [math-learn] Other Comments On High School Algebra 2
Robert Lewis

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